RE: JDM H22A or B16?
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/26/2007 4:20:33 PM
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mybrokenblinker
Posts: 2344
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don't forget that you can negte the tranny weight difference with the h2b or h2d...or maybe the adapter plate weighs a bit, i'm really not quite sure
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/26/2007 4:40:25 PM
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Pete
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14B is a really small turbo, why the hell would you put that on an H22? thats suitable for a D series turbo build.
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/27/2007 12:25:23 PM
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Marty
Posts: 8273
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quote:
ORIGINAL: reaper2022
heymikey19: You're right, I'm wrong. We've already covered this. Actually, I never said you were wrong; I merely mentioned that everyone I've talked to about h22's have said that there's a triple-digit weight difference:
quote:
ORIGINAL: reaper2022
all the weight comparisons I've seen have said at least 100lbs.
Next time, try not to get your panties in a bunch and actually help with the question a poster has at the time. The weight discussion ended on page 2.
drbyers: I think you misread what we've been saying. A normal h22 will have no real clearance issues with an EG's hood. What we were saying is that if you do an H2B swap, you'll most likely have clearance issues. And I never said you couldn't turbo an h22. I said that the h22's cylinder walls were relatively thin compared to other Honda engines, and that I personally wouldn't push the boost too high. Once again, all this information is simply things that I've heard and agreed with. I can't speak from experience seeing as how I still have a D-series sitting in my engine bay.
(and finally)bcrichguitars: from what I've seen, both the b16 and b18 handle boost extremely well on stock internals. I know for a fact that there are a ton of people running around with boosted B-series engines. But from what I've heard in both forums and magazines, b16's feel exactly like d16's until about 5500rpm, so there's really no point in getting a b16 unless all you want is that pretty dohc valve cover under the hood for as low of a price as you can get it. I say go with a b18.
I would like to state something right now and this should be taken as the gospel. The cyl liners(e.i. stock sleeves) are nowhere as weak as everyone thinks. Not on D series, not on B series(I get sick of seeing people trash the B20 because of this), not the F series, not the H series, and not the K series. This is such a overblown myth that it absolutly kills me to see people repeat it. The H22 can make everything a B series can boosted on stock block but make gobs more tq everywhere in the rpm range. All motor I dont know how you want to complain with ITR power(200hp) and 35 more ft lbs of tq for less than half the price. If you are worried about the hood used a H series transmission and cut the 2 holes for the shifter cables. These engines put 3000 pound Preludes in the low 15's to high 14's now that is a little more weight than the new SI with a K20Z in it(around 200 to 300lbs) and it is still putting down around the same times.
The H's are very good powerplants that are commonly overshadowed by the B series and talked down by people with B series swaps that wished they would have went with a H. The weight difference is complete bullshit. You slap a heavy ass manifold, turbo, intercooler piping, and intercooler on the front of a B series or D series equiped civic and look at that it has the added weight and in the total wrong place. So take it for what you want but put it this way, I have a 96 civic hatch and a B series just sitting here and I am not wasting my time combining the two.
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/27/2007 2:54:05 PM
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bcrichguitars
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Well there wouldn't be a point in a 14b on an h22 anyways right?
Is a 14b ok for a B16 or B18?
How much work would it take to put in a bigger turbo, I have a big enough intercooler, but other than the turbo what else would I need to change?
Thanks
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/27/2007 7:40:46 PM
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Marty
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You need a different turbo, maybe larger injectors. The manifold you will have to change no matter what. The 14b is actually rather small for a b16(because of it's higher rpm power range) and the B18 for the same reason which is also compounded by more displacement. What makes you want to go away from the boost d15b anyway? What else is done to the engine other than being boosted and where are you located? Is it a 5 speed?
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If you are over 18 years old in the United States and do not vote do not bitch about local, state, and national laws. This includes fix it tickets, big speeding fines, and high taxes(gas prices included)
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/28/2007 7:15:42 AM
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bcrichguitars
Posts: 372
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P06 chipped for Uberdata
B&M short shifter
JDM D15B VTEC
TE04H Turbo *Stock Wastegate at 3 PSI*
Magnaflow Cat-Back Exhaust
4-Port Aftermarket Vaccum Bar
460 cc Rx7 injectors (low impedence) with resistor box Johnny Race Car Style Front Mount Intercooler
Ceramic coated custom piping
Greddy EBC
And I wanted the b16 or b18 because I want more power. Any more suggestions?
< Message edited by bcrichguitars -- 6/28/2007 7:17:07 AM >
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/28/2007 7:51:44 AM
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Marty
Posts: 8273
Joined: 1/27/2005
From: TN
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Yea get a slightly bigger turbo and take it to a good tuner. You should be able to take the D up to around 220whp or so on a good tune and with the tq supplied by the boost you should have a solid high 12 second car and not be pushing the envelope. I had a JDM D15B and man they like to rev slightly higher than other D's. I's add a stg 2 crower n/a cam, springs, retainers, and tune that thing. I went 14 flat in the 1/4 mile with my D15B and a t25 at 9psi and I was only making around 175whp and 150wtq and this was in a full weight 98 sedan with power windows and power locks.
Really what is your ending goal? Because the setup you have is good for a damn quick car on the street.
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/28/2007 1:40:11 PM
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bcrichguitars
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What does it mean to "not be pushing the envelope". Thanks for your advice I have a few more questions though. Is doing all this work to the engine really worth it, like wouldn't the car be faster by just swapping a B16 with stock internals than building up this one?
I have already found a tuner, I was just waiting because I was planning on the B16. Do I really need a bigger turbo, what would having a bigger turbo do for me?
Thanks and sorry for so many questions.
Also you mentioned a stg 2 crower n/a cam, doesn't n/a mean naturally aspirated? You also mentioned springs and retainers, I'm not sure what that is but i could read up on them I guess. What type of shop would be able to install all this, and wouldn't this be very expensive?
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/28/2007 2:09:58 PM
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blackmetal619
Posts: 1330
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Ive only read the first page of replies, but Ive heard of a cheap mans K20.
Its an H22 with a B16 or GSR tranny. I dunno its a thought
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RE: JDM H22A or B16? - 6/28/2007 2:23:26 PM
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Marty
Posts: 8273
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From: TN
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bcrichguitars
What does it mean to "not be pushing the envelope". Thanks for your advice I have a few more questions though. Is doing all this work to the engine really worth it, like wouldn't the car be faster by just swapping a B16 with stock internals than building up this one?
I have already found a tuner, I was just waiting because I was planning on the B16. Do I really need a bigger turbo, what would having a bigger turbo do for me?
Thanks and sorry for so many questions.
Also you mentioned a stg 2 crower n/a cam, doesn't n/a mean naturally aspirated? You also mentioned springs and retainers, I'm not sure what that is but i could read up on them I guess. What type of shop would be able to install all this, and wouldn't this be very expensive?
Not pushing the envelope means you will not be stressing the engine to much. Yes a naturaly aspirated cam. Springs = valve springs, stiffer so the valves open and close with more force and they will handle higher rpms, retainers because I allways suggest fresh retainers with a new cam and springs. I dont think it will be worth either swap. You swap your 14b with a EVO III 16G turbo and you will, tuned correctly gain more hp per psi of boost. You will have slightly more turbo lag but at this point you have to weigh your options more high end hp vs better manners on the street. The 16g is not that much larger but it will make enough power to max out what your engine is capable of.
Cam, springs, and retainers should be around $500, a nice used 16G turbo around $200, and a good tune around $400 or so. That is around $1200 and man you will not do either one of those other swaps for that amount because you need to take into account that these "jdm" swaps are old and no telling how long it's been sense they have been started and drove. You dont know the condition of them so it is in your best intrest to rebuild them plus you would still need a bigger turbo, a different manifold, and the B16's compression IMO in stock form is to high for any kinda real boost. You will also still need to get your new setup tuned once all is in.
BTW there is no way a H22, B18, B20, B16 with any transmission can compare to a K series
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If you are over 18 years old in the United States and do not vote do not bitch about local, state, and national laws. This includes fix it tickets, big speeding fines, and high taxes(gas prices included)
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