Mechanical Problems & Technical Chat If you've got a problem you just can't figure out, a noise you can't diagnose, or a check engine light that won't go away, ask about it here!

98 Honda Civic performance

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 04:28 AM
  #1  
basic's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 2
Default 98 Honda Civic performance

I have a 98 honda civic. I've had the car since 02' and in general it has been very good. The mpg used to be between 35-40 depending on driving conditions. The gas millage has deteriorated to around 25 mpg.

I have changed the fuel/air filter, the plugs, the plug wires, the o2 sensor before the cat, the exhaust manifold/cat (cracked@ 130k), the distributor cap. I also have the second o2 sensor bypassed (though I was under the impression that this was only used for emission testing).

The car runs very well on a full tank of fuel. The first half tank gets me about 180-200 miles (5 gallons). It seems like the less fuel I have in the tank, the more sluggish the car becomes. The second half of the tank normally is only good for another 80-90 miles, and I find myself flooring the gas pedal to get any kind of acceleration (not fast acceleration , just any).

What would explain this kind of behavior?
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 05:35 AM
  #2  
V8DIET's Avatar
HCF Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 631
From: Cincinnati
Default

The fuel level sensor is a sensor called a rheostat potentiometer. And long story short they are not as accurate at higher voltages. (full tank) as they are at lower voltages (near empty) So the "better fuel mileage" your seeing at full tank is really just the inaccuracy of the sensor dynamics themselves. Your bypassed O2 will also contribute to the lower mileage. The PCM controls the fuel mixture and if it sees that the imputs that it's giving the engine, (rich, lean, rich, lean....) are not accurate with the O2 sensor readings, than it will go to a default rich mode so as to preserve the engine and prevent leaning out, also causing higher fuel consumption and lower MPG.
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 05:56 AM
  #3  
RonJ's Avatar
Recognized HCF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,453
From: Houston, Texas
Default

Is the CEL ON?

You need to calculate your true gas mileage. Did you replace the distributor rotor? What type of plugs did you use? Are they properly gapped? Is the engine idling too low or high? Have you checked for an exhaust leak around the exhaust manifold? You should measure the fuel pressure.

The bypassed secondary O2 sensor won't affect mileage as its readings don't influence the air-fuel ratio.
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 06:12 AM
  #4  
V8DIET's Avatar
HCF Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 631
From: Cincinnati
Default

Originally Posted by RonJ
Is the CEL ON?
The bypassed secondary O2 sensor won't affect mileage as its readings don't influence the air-fuel ratio.
I thought OBD2 vehicles used a combonation of both sensors. The secondary is just mainly used to check that the converter is doing it's job.
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 06:26 AM
  #5  
mudferret's Avatar
HCF Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 327
From: Calgary, Ab
Default

Originally Posted by RonJ
Is the CEL ON?

You need to calculate your true gas mileage. Did you replace the distributor rotor? What type of plugs did you use? Are they properly gapped? Is the engine idling too low or high? Have you checked for an exhaust leak around the exhaust manifold? You should measure the fuel pressure.

The bypassed secondary O2 sensor won't affect mileage as its readings don't influence the air-fuel ratio.
Originally Posted by V8DIET
I thought OBD2 vehicles used a combonation of both sensors. The secondary is just mainly used to check that the converter is doing it's job.
You're both right, primary O2 does all the "work", secondary ensures that the cat is doing it's work, but won't adjust fuel mixes.
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 06:41 AM
  #6  
RonJ's Avatar
Recognized HCF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,453
From: Houston, Texas
Default

Originally Posted by V8DIET
I thought OBD2 vehicles used a combonation of both sensors. The secondary is just mainly used to check that the converter is doing it's job.
Yeah, the secondary O2 sensor serves exclusively an emissions monitoring function. Readings from the primary O2 sensor, on the other hand, are used by the ECU to determine the optimal amount of fuel to burn in the cylinders.
 
Old Feb 2, 2009 | 06:49 AM
  #7  
basic's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 2
Default

I didn't use any kind of name brand spark plugs when I replaced them. I did gap them according to the repair manual.

Within the last year everything from the exhaust manifold to the muffler has been replaced.

The check engine light is no longer on. Before I had the exhaust manifold/cat replaced it was on, reading 'fuel mixture too lean'. I haven't seen this again since replacing the exhaust manifold/cat.

With the exhaust manifold/cat replaced I can remove the bypass on the second o2 censor ( after the cat ), but it sounds like this will not effect the mixture.

I am aware that the fuel gauge is less accurate below half a tank, but that doesn't account for the sluggishness. Which seems to get worse as my tank gets lower. With a fuller tank the gas pedal is more responsive, by a lot.

I did not replace the distributor rotor.

I'll have to check my repair manual for how to measure the fuel pressure. I'll do this and get back to you guys.
 

Last edited by basic; Feb 2, 2009 at 06:52 AM.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
JimmyCarter
Engine & Internal
1
May 29, 2008 06:25 PM
Philippe
Header, Intake, & Exhaust
5
May 21, 2007 03:28 PM
b_delgros
General Civic Talk
6
May 7, 2007 08:06 PM
campbuds
General Civic Talk
8
Jul 16, 2006 06:28 AM




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:01 AM.